Over at TallSkinnyKiwi there is yet another conversation brewing about the age of the revolution that is (or has been according to The Kiwi) the Emergent Movement. The debate is whether or not it's a "revolution" anymore. My frustration is that I don't think it's ever been a revolution and that particular rhetorical turn is simply, well, bombast. Well intentioned, enthusiastic, creative and even fun at times, but still...Maybe I am being harsh, but it's not been a revolution everywhere. In some places it's simply been a description of what has been at work in church for a good while.
But first, before I really sound like a jerk, let me share some links with you.
Danielle thinks that perhaps the movement has "lost its sexiness." I have to say that this is a great response. Give it a go.Too much of this conversation has been about transformation, an intentional movement of what must happen, or is the product of some network or gathering and too little of it has been about what simply is happening all on its own without the aid of publishing houses or creative websites.
Tony Jones is working through some stuff as well. He sees some interesting posturing among Vineyard and other such movements.
Josh Brown is pretty well convinced that institutional Christianity (other than friendships and families) is done. We'll see how this plays out, but it's not an uncommon statement.
Nick Fiedler is tired of all the talk with little action. I guess there's not been enough change for him.
I posted a while back about my understanding of this whole mess. The church that is emerging is emerging from the existing structures, institutions, and communities...liberal or conservative, mega church or mainline. It's not as if these conversations and the related actions have appeared ex nihilo. They have been nurtured. I, for one, have been nurtured within the older forms and encouraged into what some wish to call new, radical, or emergent. But they aren't really. Fosdick, Coffin (Jr), even Jimmy Carter and Billy Graham are examples of Emergence. Moody? Perhaps. New forms, odd places of worship etc. Heck, some could even include Methodism in this line of thinking and transformation.
So, not to sound ungenerous, I would love to know how emergence is a revolution. Perhaps I am too much in Phyllis Tickle's camp on this one, but I think it is only one small iteration of what is simply happening across the board. Acceptance and embrace of what has changed is what we need and not revolution. It can still be exciting and even sexy. Heck, why not? Get creative. Change everything that won't keep up with what is changing. That's fine. But recognize that we are simply part of something larger, something more pervasive than a revolution powered by certain personalities.
I don't know if this makes sense, but let me know your thoughts.
Posted by tripp at December 30, 2009 08:42 PM | TrackBackAlso you'll notice that the quote about "institutional" Christianity being done is mine - and I obviously still struggle with that perspective - but I've begun to see that there is hope for an "emergence" within traditional church structures. So that's a bit of a change in that I'm no longer convinced that the "institution" has to die in order to be the birthplace of life-giving forms of faith (though I'm not yet fully convinced that it's the ideal setting either).
Grace & peace,
A.T.
Posted by: Andrew Tatum at December 30, 2009 10:51 PMWell said Tripp
Posted by: The kiwi at December 31, 2009 04:27 AMKiwi, thank you.
Andrew, I appreciate both your comments and can relate to your struggle. I did not grow up in the church and did not enter into the Church through any one denominational tradition. This likely skews my perspective quite a bit. Still, I have been privy to various "emerging" communities within traditional structures.
That being said, there are plenty of traditional structures bent on maintaining only their own inertia. It's tremendously frustrating because they teach their people (their children especially) one thing and do another. But that is a post for another day!
Peace.
Posted by: Tripp at December 31, 2009 07:17 AMI don't see a revolution needed. If some churches want emerging or emergence, I say go for it. To each his own. I do agree with
there is a lot of talk and not much doing.
I think that I am being too "hard" on things and
then something comes up that goes with the way I feel. Reading the Bible and just living day to day I see that regarding the Big Issues like poverty, injustice regarding rich / poor (countries, industries, etc.)things are still the same.
I had just been thinking to myself that the system we have set up doesn't nor ever will work in regards to all people all over the world. And that does include the church to me.
For my French homework, I have to watch the French news every day. Whoa.
What violence is going on around the world. The French news is about 20 minutes and covers the whole world. In contrast, the US evening news focuses on US and US propaganda.
On one report, the French news showed clips from
a new French movie: Le Fin de la Pauvrete. (the end of poverty) In the film it shows what is actually going on EVERYWHERE. It also gives some facts. Here is the one that stuck with me: The US is only 5% of the world's total population and yet it uses 25% of its resources. Hmmmm.
There were a couple of revealing things from this
report. 1. Somebody else is looking at the Big Picture, not just me and seeing that our system is not working. One of the statements made in the film is exactly: The system we have is not working. 2. The other countries in the world have realized that the US is not as fair and just as we want people to think. (tv5 had reports on the Copenhagen convention on global warming. Really revealing also. If anybody caught it.) When I refer to "the system is not working" --I am referring to the whole world, not just the US.
I find church a big fluff. It doesn't ever really want to face the issues. It pats people on the back and says, "God forgives you" or "God loves you" or "God bless you" but doesn't want to do the things necessary to bring justice in the world. The church as well as politicians
are going to smoothe it over.
I feel like the church is in Middle Class America
Comfort Zone. See no evil, hear no evil, speak no evil. They are much more interested in argueing doctrine than helping people.
There was a sermon at my church once on the prophet Amos. He was preaching an unpopular
message. He was talking about just that: God's economic plan vs. the world. The world's system is based on scarcity and God focuses on abundance.
I have seen too much slide by at church, at work, etc. to know better than to think that we have done enough.
Not even close.
The mentality is still messed up.
It is still favoring the rich.
Examples:
new tax on pollution brought up to be a new law in France. The people were outraged. 93% of the big industries who are causing the most pollution totally exempt. It didn't pass. Gee, I wonder why.
Obama met with the finance industry. Before the meeting he talked about the big bonuses they were receiving using the government stimulus money. After the meeting, he flipped the script. He made a statement that he did not want to interfere with the compensation practices of the banks.
Claims were brought up 3 times regarding Bernie Madoff and they were completely ignored. Basically because of his status.
The list goes on and on. I am not including the things I have seen on a smaller scale in offices and churches.
The focus is not right. It is still favoring those who are "successful" or with status. And the idea of what success is is messed up.
Posted by: Teresa at December 31, 2009 11:30 AM